Time to leave - a rant

Time to leave - a rant

by: Mia - 03-07-09 10:38

After having a very stressful day I am considering leaving the profession, The only reason being is the manager not supporting the safety of the staff and children and backing the wrong people beacuse all they think of is money!

I am so angry as we wasent even listened to by her but looked at as if we were in the wrong for protecting our children and staff from an intimadating parent! We all wrote reports straight after it happened which havent even been read!

All we were told was think of money we get from their fee and she would of dealt with it better, funny thing is she only pays minimum wage! Now today she is in a foul mood and picking on everyone and nit picking, she also only works 2 days a week! so totally fed up now but needed a rant !

by: Maestro

Chin up Mia, the weekend is but a mere few hours away. Have a rest, have a sleep and then sort it after if needed. Never do anything with a hot head.

by: Mia

Think it's affecting me more because this is'nt the first time it's happened and shes making that move from children first to money and nothing but!

by: kaz (the first one!)

Being a manger can be hard (not defending yours!) as you have to wear two hats - one for care and one for business! Sometimes we make the wrong call and most of the time we have to look further than the immediate present and into the future. Sometimes it is easier to let staff take the blame and the parent 'win' than fight the other way - this is not always right and managers do need to talk to their staff about their decisions. 

I hope you have a better week next week. 

Ps - how are you on the internet at 10:38 in the morning??

by: Mia

 I dont start till 1.00, I am a deputy manager so I know the full implacations of the money side of things but if a parent was screaming and shouting in front of your 3 year olds wouldnt you ask her to leave?

by: kaz (the first one!)

No I wouldn't ask her to leave, I'd ask her come into another room and discuss it. As deputy manager you should be able to deflect these situations and deal with them (assuming it was you that was there??) 

Hopefully you will be able to calm down over the weekend before you make any decisions about leaving the profession -  we all have days we feel like jacking it all in. I've had a few weeks with Ofsted, au upset parent and a staff member who has now lost her job and although it's not been an easy decision, it's one that HAD to be made.

by: Mia

It started off in the office actually then when she started getting intimadating and shouting and swearing and pointing in my face I asked her to leave as it was not getting us any where and I felt threatened by her, she then took herself off into another room despite warnings that the police would be called as she had already had a go at another member of staff, the only way to diffuse the suitation for the safety of everyone was to ask her to leave (around 10 times actually)

by: kaz (the first one!)

Then it sounds like you did everything you could. Some parents you cannot calm down and some will see reason.

I hope you feel better for your rant!

RE: RE: Time to leave - a rant - 03-07-09 19:18

by: Debs

HI

I'm really sorry to hear you have been treated in this way and strongly believe that just because a parent is fee paying does not give them the right to be disrespectful, intimidating and abusive to staff because they have either had a bad day or something is not right.  

It sounds as if you did everything right and I agree that asking the parent to leave was the most appropraite action to take given the fact that other children, staff and parents were there.

As a Manager I would support your actions and ask the parent if she would attend a meeting to discuss the cause for her concern at a more appropraite time when she has clamed down,  and try to come to an amicable soultion which would suit both parties.

If she has a greviance with the care there are appropraite channels to follow this up and any constructive criticism can be used as an advantage to improve practice, however if her behaviour is not the result of the care then the Manager needs to support the staff and explain to the parent that this behaviour is not acceptable and that she will not tolerate her staff being treated in this way.

Whilst i appreciate that she has a business to run, how does she think the other parents felt being witness to this, where is the customer care for those parents and where is her loyalty in retaining staff.

I think the manager may be wise to consider the wider implications of her actions and consider what impact this could have on her staffing , if they leave because they feel unsupported,  other parents will get restless with a high staff turnover.

 Managers have to make a stand to protect their staff, reputation and parents and it is not a wise move to brush these things aside because there is one parent who cannot behave in public.  It makes me wonder how her child behaves.

I rest my case.

Yours a sensible and reflective Manager 

 

by: mickey

MIA...

Say The word And Mick will get some lads Together and have a chat with your Ouhhhh So nice Manager.

like Maestro Siad right above me.... the weekend is here. Have some wine and Chocs. Make a Voodoo Doll of your manager.Stick pins in it.... Or get some quick dry cement, Stick the Managers feet in it. Mia I'm with you Hun. Just have a good weekend.....

by: Mia

Thank Debs and Mickey it has really upset me to the point of tears today, she wouldnt even read the reports that were perpared from the 6 staff that witnessed it! Is there anything i can do does anyone know ive tried talking to her about my feelings on the suitation but keep getting told "i'm not listening" so i wondered if there was anything else i could do, the whole mood in the nursery is really low and deflated now I know that losing fee is hard i really do but to be not backed up and her take it out on everyone today which she really has! has made me feel really low now.

It's so hard to make her try and understand that i was protecting everyone and she thinks it was just an over reaction which it really was not.

by: billabong

I ALWAYS FULLY SUPPORT MY STAFF , there is no dout in my mind that she/he SHOULD BE BANNED. HOW dare ANYONE TREAT you like this. DON'T do anymore, DON'T even try to negotiate just give her her notice. HOW DARE SHE!!!!! Do you want Devon Nursery Nurses on the case? We'll sort it out! Wont we Kimmie!!!!!

by: whmon

As an owner, and before I'm shouted down, let me say that I do support my staff. For example, in our recent Ofsted we dropped from 'Good' to 'Satisfactory'. Partly because many of the directives I'd given had not been carried out. Rather than raise the roof, I gave all of the staff an individual letter, praising them on their good points and telling them how worthwhile they are, and enclosing £20 per person. Most of them came and thanked me in tears.

Also, I have in the past asked a parent of a full time child to leave although she was an exemplary fee payer. This was because she treated the staff as if they were her personal pool of 'downstairs staff'. I may have upset her in more ways than one, as I told her that the only way she could have the type of childcare she wanted was to do 'like I did when my child was small and employ a full time live in qualified nanny' (Mrs Bucket, as we called her was quite visibly annoyed that someone could see through her.)

However, you don't say in your post WHY the parent was so upset that she was shouting. Your manager is possibly trying to protect jobs. Remember that if 2 or 3 other parents feel the same way then that is a ratio gone, and a job lost. The manager must also protect her own job. I for one would not be happy if my manager was allowing staff to lose fee payers. That would mean that the manager's job would be under threat. Also, a nursery nurse's position is much easier to find than a manager's position. Your manager, I feel, is trying to protect your job and his or own.

by: kimme

Definitely a case for Devon Nursery Nurses, Billabong......

Sounds like you're worth more than this to me!

Definitely time to head for the wine and chocs - another of  D NN strong points

PLEASE try to enjoy your weekend

by: Mia

whomn, she wasent following one of our polices and the room leader tried to tell her but she wasent happy with it, she then spoke to me and i backed my staff member as she was doing her job,

by: mickey

Mia, Let me tell you a brief storey True. My 1st job was in Great Bar.The mananger had me in the office one day for something. And i ended up telling her to her face, The staff did'nt like her. Which, Shocked her, She ended up having it out with all the staff, We had her in tears, Things changed for a few months, But she went back to the way she was. she was so false. No one would tell her to start with, what they thought of her, It was down to me, So i told her.

My point is Managers sometimes need putting in there place. Remember this, if the manager as lost the staff, He or she may as well leave. It's like a footy team who no longer likes the manager they end up NOT playing for the manager... And some managers will do well to remember they can get sacked, Just like the staff......

Mia on the sly, Start looking for a better setting with a good manager

by: Lolly

Mia, sorry to hear about your upset.  Bosses and managers should always support their staff in these situations and to hell with the money.  Drink wine and be merry and sod the lot of them is what I say.  Tell your manager that minimum wage or not that you do not have to put up with parents being threatening towards you it is unacceptable.  Enjoy your weekend and don't be to hasty on leaving childcare.

by: Mia

I tried everything i possible could to get her to see why I did what I did but it really is not going in! Thinking about my own nursery now a nice idea that may never amount to antyhing as i dont have a penny but a shame as I have loads of ideas and experience - oh well!!

Just a shame its really made me feel crap about returning to work on monday!!

by: Helen W

Hi Mia

Just wanted to say good luck in the hope that over time maybe you can find the time and space to discuss it quietly. I don't suppose you belong (or all of you belong) to a union or unions, so you can get someone in from outside to help mediate and run a discussion or other session around learning and policies and bullying and so on?

Another route you might want to think about (again perhaps easier if you are supported by a union) is to consider taking a formal grievance which presumably you will have a policy on which will describe procedures , forms etc. I appreciate that often taking out a formal grievance can seem a strong action, but that is what the processes are there for, to resolve issues at work, and certainly this sounds like something that needs both immediate resolution and longer-term management handling (how will parents who behave inappropriately be handled in the future, how are staff supported in difficult relationships with parents, do any bullying/harassment/dignity-at-work policies need reviewing etc).

I'm sure as a thoughtful  manager you've already run through these things in your head, but  thought I'd try and help anyway! And as I do work for a union and have seen things get resolved (I know unions get a bad press but you'd be amazed at what also gets sorted with some external mediation and support) I thought maybe I could try and add to your own thoughts with the knowledge that it can be worked through - so don't give up, or at least not yet! :-)

Good luck in your shift today, which I guess you're already doing ...

Helen

by: mickey

How Did Today Go Mia ?

by: Mia

she was ill so didnt come in (big sigh of relief!)

by: mickey

lol mia lets hope she's got swine flu

by: curly

she wasent following one of our polices and the room leader tried to tell her but she wasent happy with it,

What do you mean she wasn't following a policy? Are they enshined in law?

by: mickey

Led Zepplin once said ' Oh h h and it me makes me wonder'

Led Zepplin Must have worked in a day Nursery at one point, And writ this tune... Some People, just have'nt got a clue, And before anyone says it YES , I have'nt either...

by: Mia

do you know what curly, thank you for taking the time to quote what ive said but to be totally honest that post does not really mean a thing to me, "what do you mean she wasent following a policy" I mean she was not following a policy! simple as!

by: curly

You say she wasn't following a policy but what kind of policy are you referring to? It might shed some light on why the parent wasn't following it.

Even when a parent appears clearly in the wrong, it is good practice to try to look objectively at a situation and try to understand the other persons' point of view to explore what changes could be made to avoid such a difficult and uncomfortable situation reoccurring.

by: Mia

we have 3 children with serious life threatening allergies in our nursery we have adapted menus, policies and routines to be able to have these children in a safe environment, everybody has had to have epi pen training and one of our policies is that we dont allow food into the nursery from parents (unless its babies) this lady has been told time and time again that we dont allow food into the setting and this time we made a stand and said no, hence she didnt like it.

by: mickey

MIA.... Despit what Curly is saying. if parents don't like things Despite life threatening illness's. It sounds as though you are doing the right thing.... Ok a child dies This will land on your doorstep not the parents, so all the people that are having a digg at you, YOU are doing the right thing, N carry on doing this....

by: curly

Mickey - look again, no one is having a dig and no one said Mia is in the wrong. Being a reflective practitioner is about thinking about what we could do to avoid a similar situation and sometimes it can help to talk it through with others, like on this forum.....

by: mickey

Good. Because, Mia is'nt in the wrong. Un like me, Who is never right. Oh well. Yes i agree. It does help to talk with others, Hear, Hear....

by: drcrabbere

Its good to have a rant.

Do not allow anyone to put you off your profession especially if you enjoy your job. Sometimes when discomforts occur it could help us to think about our situation and re-group or as you have said, to leave. Only you can decide this; but give yourself time to reassess. It could be a move to greater things - That happened to me, so take courage with good planning.

People today are mostly thinking about money; things are getting tougher with the strained economy and money has slowly become the focus of life. It is ofcourse, important for our future upkeep in our senior years.

Whatever you do; all good wishes.

by: kaz (the first one!)

Mia - was your manager telling the parent she could bring food in? Did you mean that was the policy she was ignoring? 

by: Mia

Thats the policy thats in place (actually wrote by the manager herself and the parent ignored it despite there being lots of posters around), The manager was off on the day in question when the parent tried to bring food in - a bag of cheese and onion crisps actually for breakfast! Obviously the room senior said no and the suituation arose. The manager never actually spoke about the policy or the food when she was told by me the next day and just started ranting about the fee that was lost.